It takes two to tango: in conversation with Ed Balls and Sir David Bell

<p>“On the one hand, the cabinet minister has to understand that nature of the civil service role and the role of the permanent secretary as a leader alongside you…</p> <p>“But I think the permanent secretary also has to respect that the cabinet minister is not necessarily someone to be shaped in content or style to the previous way of doing things.”</p> <p>In this special episode, Sir David Bell and Ed Balls explore the minister-permanent secretary relationship.</p> <p>The two joined forces in 2007 at what was the Department for Children, Schools and Families – David as permanent secretary and Ed as secretary of state. They discuss first impressions and how they built a coherent team and vision together based on chemistry, trust, and openness, with plenty of fun thrown in there too.</p> <p>But it wasn’t all plain sailing. The department faced a series of crises including SATs results, payments of Educational Maintenance Grants and the tragedy of Baby P. Both Ed and David talk about how they worked together in a crisis, and personally managed the pressure.</p> <p>If you would like to suggest an interviewee for the show, or tell us what you think, you can get in touch by emailing <a href= "mailto:ggfeditor@gmail.com">ggfeditor@gmail.com</a>. If you are enjoying the show, we would really appreciate it if you could share it widely and give us a rating.</p> <p>Your host was Siobhan Benita. Kate Hodge edited the episode, and it was produced by James Ede.</p>